Moments after Paul Ryan's speech, Gov. Scott Walker of Wisconsin got into a fiesty and heated exchange with the MSNBC panel. Walker defended Ryan's misleading claim that Obama failed to save a Wisconsin auto plant, and even appeared to claim that for Wisconsin workers, the Obama administration's auto bailout hasn't been a success.
As you can guess, Rachel, Ed, Al and company didn't let him off the hook. Watch:
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I am so fed up with the GOP and their media hacks on Fox ( and at the RNC Convention ) talking about the President as though being a Lawyer and being President are at cross purposes. Here is a list of just how many of our Presindents have been Lawyers. Try being honest for ONCE in your miserable lives Reich=Wing Republicans !
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
This is a list of the occupations of Presidents before they entered politics. Often, previous career experience is minimal; however, many presidents did spend their younger years in college and/or the military.
Order
President
Previous occupation(s)
1 George Washington
Land Surveyor, Farmer/plantation owner, Soldier (General of United Army of the Colonies)
2 John Adams
Lawyer, Farmer
3 Thomas Jefferson
Land Surveyor, Writer, Inventor, Lawyer, Architect, Farmer/Plantation owner
4 James Madison
Farmer/plantation owner, Lawyer
5 James Monroe
Farmer/plantation owner, Lawyer
6 John Quincy Adams
Lawyer
7 Andrew Jackson
Soldier, Lawyer
8 Martin Van Buren
Lawyer
9 William Harrison
Soldier
10 John Tyler
Lawyer
11 James Polk
Lawyer, Plantation owner
12 Zachary Taylor
Soldier
13 Millard Fillmore
Lawyer
14 Franklin Pierce
Lawyer
15
James Buchanan
Lawyer, Diplomat
16
Abraham Lincoln
Land Surveyor, Lawyer
17
Andrew Johnson
Tailor
18
Ulysses Grant
Soldier, General of the Army
19
Rutherford Hayes
Lawyer
20
James Garfield
School teacher, minister, soldier
21
Chester Arthur
School teacher, lawyer, collector of tariffs
22, 24
Grover Cleveland
Sheriff, lawyer, assistant teacher
23
Benjamin Harrison
Lawyer, journalist
25
William McKinley
Lawyer
26
Theodore Roosevelt
Public Official, Rancher
27
William Taft
Lawyer, judge, law reporter, dean of law school at the University of Cincinnati
28
Woodrow Wilson
Lawyer, professor, president of Princeton University
29
Warren Harding
Newspaper publisher/editor
30
Calvin Coolidge
Lawyer, Vice President of Northampton Savings Bank
31
Herbert Hoover
Engineer, Investor
32
Franklin Roosevelt
Lawyer
33
Harry Truman
Farmer, Men's clothing retailer
34
Dwight Eisenhower
Soldier, General, President of Columbia University,
35
John F. Kennedy
Writer, Sailor (Navy Lieutenant)
36
Lyndon Johnson
Teacher, Public Official
37
Richard Nixon
Lawyer, Sailor (Navy Lieutenant Commander)
38
Gerald Ford
Sailor (Navy Lieutenant Commander), Lawyer
39
Jimmy Carter
Sailor (Navy Lieutenant),[1] peanut farmer,[2] writer
40
Ronald Reagan[3][4]
Actor & broadcaster, President of the Screen Actors Guild[5]
41
George H. W. Bush
Pilot (Navy Lieutenant, Junior Grade),[6] Businessman (Oil)[7]
42
Bill Clinton
Lawyer, Law lecturer
43
George W. Bush
Businessman (Oil,[8] baseball)[9]
44
Barack Obama
Public Interest professional, writer, Lawyer,[citation needed] Law Professo
And here Neill de Grasse Tyson makes a good point about lawyers:
youtube.com/watch?v=YnsbZzJ2H_k
Which also fits perfectly to the GOP event: No convictions, only slogans.
MSNBC Anchors have to step up there game. I saw last night where you let people off the hook and they got away with untruths, and today MSNBC anchors are getting steamrolled by republican spokespeople. Andrea Mitchell just got destroyed by Tim Pawlenty, T-Paw!
I wouldn't be praising yourselves about scott walker, calling someone out isn't asking a question and then letting him make all his points especially when they are not true. Rachel I get your style, you gently ask a question that will hopefully yield the obvious answer, but when that happens, you have to bring the hammer of truth. When they ramble it's because they are caught, you need to step in and take control, as anchors your suppose to know how to do that, you let walker gain control of that conversation. When Big Eddie stepped in it seemed initially like he would do better but he also ultimately gave up control. Rev Al is normally good at cornering someone into the truth but seemed to get lost in the mix. You guys have to decide what each of your roles are and be more effective. Rachel you always talk about how you contact republicans and they won't come on your show, after how you got steamrolled last night, they may change their minds. I thought you Ed were on the right path before Al spoke up, and that the people of Janestown have the republican policies to blame for their plants closing.Even Bush on his auto bailout made a strong case for why the bailout was needed versus why bankruptcy wouldn't be the right option amongst others to refute mitts claims of credit.
Also, you left so much on the table with condi Rice( Matthews, Mitchell) I don't have enough room. Bottom line, your not on your own shows saying what you want unopposed. These are one shot interviews, Step it up, be prepared, I know your capable. Good Luck tonight.
Facts are facts:
SUV (a majority of the plant's production) halted December 22, 2008
Light Truck (a small volume of production) halted April, 2009
Plant placed on Stand-by (according to this GM press release) on June 26, 2009
The plant didn't close under Bush! It closed June 2009, under Obama. The plant had 2 major contracts, one was for SUV, which closed production in Dec. of 08, the 2nd contract was for light trucks which closed June of 09'. This is typical liberal spin!
metoo999. WRONG. Typical Fox, brainless, mindless, believe anything but the facts spin! Obama had no part at all in that plant closing.
Of course, I know I am hitting a brick wall, but a fact is still a fact.
OBAMA HAD ZERO TO DO WITH IT, ZERO!!!! That was all decided before he took office.
The reason they didn't finish closing until 2009 is they had to honor their previous contracts. It's not like closing a grocery store.
The convention is loaded with liars both the speakers and the audience. What do you expect from this political party? One speaker blamed Obama and ask to stop blaming his own brother who put this country in a ditch with two unpaid wars and tax cuts with the 1%. Squander the surplus left by a Democrat President and shoot sky high the deficit that this party is crying about. It’s Obama's fault nobody else including the "Do Nothing Congress" whose only main goal is to have him a one term. Keep on lying folks and fools are jumping. Replace Obama and then cry later.
"Freedom and Prosperity" More empty rhetoric...Romney is on record for burying domestic industry...
Romney 's Bain turned around over 80% of the companies they invested in.
Here in Ohio over 20,000 Delphi retirees lost over 60% of they retirement due to Obama special treatment of favorites in union. Screwed the salaried employees even gave them cancer and heart attacks.
He can control the weather, he can give people cancer - damn, next he will be able to walk on water.
And by the way, you are wrong.
Check it out - Google politifact Delphi Ohio to get the truth.
While salaried and managerial employees of Delphi, a major parts supplier to General Motors, lost part of their pensions, unionized employees did not. The unions got a pension rescue, which had nothing to do with Obama. Get your facts straight TheTrollOU812. You're spreading false information. That makes you a liar.
Republicans will believe anything "just trust" them (Ann Romney)
LOL, LOL, LOL. Sure, trust them? I don't think so.
where do you think the pension rescue came from it was part of the auto bale out
You can always tell when he is lying, he just wants to talk and talk and talk. Thank you Rachael and Ed for having the guts to stand up to Walker, he and Ryan got caught red handed tonite. He was irate, I loved it. There motto is to divide and conquer, just like they did here in Wi. and that was what Ryan was all about tonight. He never mentioned his failings as a Congressman, and all the big spending bills he voted for under Bush. There is nothing fiscally conservative about Ryan and I noticed he didn't mention his $716 billion cut to medicare and what he was using it for, as opposed to Obama's $716 billion and what he was using it for. He lied about the triple A rating. Reagan's debt went from 1 trillion to 2.9 trillion, Bush Sr. from2.9 trillion to 4.2 trillion and Bush Jr. from 5.6 trillion to 10.7 trillion and this is fiscal responsibility, who is he trying to fool. Oh right his base!
Yes but, remember the voters saw through the DEMS lies here in WI and will see through the DEMS AND NBC spin of words in November.
R & R in 2012!!
What lies are you referring to. Please enlighten us.
Yeah and after the smoke cleared in Wisconsin, Walker found himself in a strait-jacket so he could'nt harm anyone else, and the Dems in control of the Senate!!! AHHHAAAahaaa
Except they don't HAHAHAHAHA
Question. Are you better off now than you were four years ago? Are there more or less people working today than there were when Obama came into office? What's the unofficial employment rate? Do you want four more years of the last four?
Right.... the Democrats control the Senate in Wisconsin. Which comes first, another session or another election? Think of it like this, someone loaned you a really nice car, but you can't drive it. And on the first day you are allowed to drive it they're coming back to pick it up.
OBAMA 2012!
All I wanted to say to Ryan is: LIAR. Do these people you can't fact check them? They're the ones giving the most wealthy tax cuts while killing the middle class worker. They can't wait to get their hands on Medicare/caid and Social Security.
want facts? see the link below! Paul Ryan & Scott Walker were correct! sadly, the claims of Rachel Maddow, Chris Matthews, Howard Fineman, Ed Schultz ("I'm not gonna let him get away with that!") and others regarding VP nominee Paul Ryan lying about the Janesville GM plant in Wisconsin have been proven to be wrong! The plant stopped production of SUVs in 2008 but it was still open and in production of light trucks when Obama became president and it's status was "idled" in 2009. Here's the link from the Wisconsin publication that ran a story on it in 2011: ** I hope they issue an apology to both men! But, i won't hold my breath.
And the teabagger sucker supporters eat up those lies like candy. No one ever said they were the smartest bunch in the world.
Here's the link:
So.... MSNBC doesn't allow people to post links so they can educate themselves on issues?? Just go to
http : fwd slash fwd slash m (dot) JSonline (dot) fwd slash business fwd slash 130171578 (dot) html
R & R in WI - R&R is that repair and replace...That is about the only thing you can do with republicans....repair them or replace them....
moron...
April 23, 2009 was the official closing date of this GM plant. As published by the Milwaukee-Wisconsin Journal.
I would love to see just once when Ed or Rachel ever used the whole truth instead of just half truths.
I see. So Obama was president for 3 months when the plant closed. Clearly, it was his policies that were to blame.
I will never understand why the people of WI gave Weaselface Walker another chance and didn't kick him out of office when they had the chance. The days of Dems turning the other cheek are going to have to be over or they are going to get mowed down by the evil Repubs. You cannot give those guys the benefit of the doubt because they will stab you in the back.
Walker sticks with Ryan, Ryan sticks with Walker, that is why Romney will lose Wisconsin.
Walker may have won the recall, but he and his ilk are of no help for Romney.
There's only one flaw in your logic. Walker won Wisconsin. Now that I think of it, two flaws. Because so did Ryan. Over and over again.
They both took a very partisan half-truth perspective on the plant closing in Jaynesville. Walker tried to turn that into a talking point to bash Obama's handling of the GM bailout and his violation of bankruptcy law to take care of his thug union buddies.
The date of the closing of the plant though is one datapoint. The fact that Obama stood in front of that very plant and made some statements about what he would do for that plant and those workers is another datapoint. I don't hold Obama personally to blame for what happened in the plant. But I do hold Obama accountable for his words about how he would create policies that would encourage growth so that hundreds of plants like Jaynesville would be in a better position after four years of his presidency. He FAILED. Obama's economic policies at a macro level are a complete FAILURE.
So while Maddow and Ed and company can snipe over Walker and Ryan and take great offense at statements like this and pick apart the statements, sometimes appropriately so (as in this instance), that doesn't obviate the big picture problem with Obama - HIS ECONOMIC POLICIES SUCK. He is a disaster for the private sector. The plant in Jaynesville is nothing more than a prop for making that case, even if it's a bad one given that the closing didn't happen on Obama's watch.
Irm - You are right. I live in Wisconsin and everything I read or hear about says President Obama takes Wisconsin. Walker lied through Koch money to get elected but that won't be the case for POTUS.
Red,
There is just one problem with your statement. Obama hasn't been able to enact any substantive policies because of the obstructive behaviors by the Republicans. Plus, if the private sector is in such abysmal shape, then why are corporate profits at highs that have never been seen before in this nations history?
The only thing the POTUS can do is "encourage" things to happen. He/she can't actually "do" anything. If Congress is unable or unwilling to do anything then there is your problem. This is the Republican myth, companies don't create jobs millionaires and top earners DO NOT make jobs. People like me, my family, the poor, the middle class, and everyone who actually has money to spend CREATE JOBS. We live in an economy where if the middle class is doing well, so is the rest of the economy.
What we keep seeing is the result of what happens when money is taken out of the economy, but is not being put back into the economy, i.e. reinvestment. You can thank the top earners and corporations for creating this mess. It is because they have not been held accountable for greed that the rest of us suffer. So unless CONGRESS does something we will scapegoat whoever is president despite whatever policies they hold.
If Romney were a Catholic, as I am, I still would not vote for him. It isn't his religion, but his Draconian policies which I find untenable. His religion differs mainly in the fact that Mormons do not accept the trinity as mainstream Christians do. They, in fact, agree with the Muslims on the trinity. ( A little known factoid).
The president, a Christian, accepts the trinity. Romney is closer to being a Muslim than Obama!
If Obama were a Muslim, I'd still vote for him. It is not his religion, but his policies which I like. I don't think religion belongs in politics.
Having said that, as a Catholic, I cannot vote for someone who disregards the poor. Both Romney and Ryan would hurt the poor a great deal. To me that is sinful. That is against all Christian morality.
Skywarp
I've heard this idiots argument too many times. Under your logic the more we have to spend, as middle class the better the economy does. That only works as long as there is a product to buy. The opposite is true, the more product produced the better off the middle class is.
If Apple had 10 Ipads to sell and had enough money to buy the products, pay employees, and produce 10 more Ipads then they would be able to sell 20 Ipads. Thus, big corporation produces jobs, the worker gets payed and can buy product.
Now take the same Apple company with 10 ipads, now the government takes taxes from them and give that money to 10 people. Those 10 people didn't produce anything but, because of the government have the money to go buy 10 ipads. But because they didn't produce anything to earn that money we now have 1/2 the product for the same amount of buyers. Now the ten guys with the most money and desire push the price up ( inflating the price and devaluing the dollar).
This is how the REAL world works. More people with more money causes inflation unless some smart guy( business owner) sees an increase in demand and produces more of that product.
Your argument may not sound totally out of touch and stupid if it weren't for the fact that President Obama had a Super Majority for 2 years, got everything he wanted passed and still failed. Since then the House has passed many things that have stalled in the democratically run senate.
GOP didn't want GM and Chrysler to go out of business just Chapter 11 reorganization it would have saved us over $25,000,000,000. Team MSNBC - MMFA will never get it.
The GOP wanted to eviscerate the unions. Period. Let's not play this nonsense. There was no private sector money available to do a "debt reorganization". Period.
There was no option for the chapter 11, no help for them at all without obama's plan and government help. the was no one in the private sector with the money and willingness to support such a thing. it was either save it as obama or let it die. give the man credit where credit is due even if you don't agree with everything else he's done.
TheTroll...it was NOT a bailout, it was a loan, and it has been payed back...Pay attention troll.....
You pay attention. Why does the government have shares of GM they can't sell without losing money? GM paid one loan off with another. Get a clue.
Well Brian and Suz, GM is headed to the same place. Market share is falling, their car line is 2nd class and no ideas in sight. Do we send more good money after bad or, finally, reorganize them as what should have happened the first time?
#5 The big difference would have been we wouldn't be in debt for that money and the union wouldn't be the new shared owners. Oh yes the stockholders wouldn't have lost their butts and a number of dealerships that didn't support Obama would still be in business.
5.2 Too many to lose. The creditors would have lost as well. That's why they would have done anything to save it. Face it, it was a union payoff.
5.3 Ever heard of that "Where's the Beef". Where's the money at least the rest of the sandwich.
5.4 What's the new stock value? That's you answer.
5.5 Rented Chev as few months ago. Closed the driver door. Only problem the interior closed but the exterior was still open.
Under any type of reorg, the original shareholders were going to be screwed, that's kinda the whole point of bankruptcy. But, as pointed out, there was NO private money available, no bank willing, to help them.
The unions did not get a "pay off"; the unionized workers settled for the uncertainty of stock shares for the pensions that should have still been there. Instead, GM got laws changed so they could gamble with that money (and lost it) and convert much of it into executive bonuses and pensions. That is, they robbed the workers, then tried to blame the workers for executive wrongs.
And the rabid right fell for it, hook, line, and sinker. Why?!
they lie lie lie lie and those republicans at that convention just don't care. if ryan had farted, they would have packaged it and added it to a apple pie. evidently, they can't handle the truth.
Jesus F'N Christ this guy's an idiot!
Republicans didn't want GM and Chrslyer to fail just go through reorganization on their own. Without involving over $25,000,000,000 in taxpayer money.
The auto was not a bailout it was a loan and they paid it back plus.
What about the free money that was handed to the banks and big business with no stipulations and ended up using to give there Co's big bonuses and didn't have to pay it back.
They in turn didn't try and help the American people or help start jobs, the object from the first was to get Obama out of office, they didn't want him in there because he want to regulate the banks and was trying to fix it so we wouldn't have to go through the same thing again
If you people can't have seen what was going I don't know what to say.
These people would dither kill the country then to see him in the office and that what they are doing and it is continuing.
The banks could have refinance the loan at a fix rate a lot of people could have stayed in their homes, if they haven't been put there payments on adjustable loans where they raise three times there payment they could have stay in them.
Everyone talks about the unions breaking this country where did you get the minmum wage, 40 hour weeks with benefits. When the Unions were the ones that help keep the workers with protection before they stated breaking them down, this country was in good shape. that, and when they when they went to right to work states and out sourcing our jobs, workers lost all there protections no control over wages and that when wages started coming down.
With the banks with pratitory loans is is when these country started going down.
Then with the 2 wars which Iraq was in question we went completely where we are at today.
Do you really feel we need to get in another war and let someone who outsourced our jobs and is in with the big business is going to look out for the average American?
What about medicare do you really want vouchers? they will be a set limit and when the insurance companies increase the the prices of there product that you won't be paying more?
Do you really feel if they stop the Obamacare they will take people with per-conditions and then no hav limits on their care, have free preventive care ?
I hope people will check out the facts and not listen to all the mis-information before you vote
You are nuts, The government has GM stock they can't sell because it's worth 25b less than when they got it. The UAW got preferential treatment and stock they weren't entitled to because of their support fro Obama. Chrysler's bond holders were shafted when Obama's administrator ignored the law.
Hello....Is this the Washington Health Approval Office? Yes Sir it is. I need my hip replaced right away, it's killing me. Sorry sir, but the person you need to speak with isn't in. Well, can I speak to someone else? Yes sir but first we need to know what party affiliation you are? Huh? Yes Sir, we have been performing more Republican hip replacements than Democrat replacements and we have to have some more Democrat hip replacements to balance it out before you become eligible. Can I change my party affiliation and then get the operation? Well Sir, only if you show proof you voted your new party affiliation next year and by the way what is your current age? 72. Well we'll need Harry Reid's approval first. We'll get with you. LOL.
Hello...is this my for-profit insurance company health approval office? Yes sir it is. I need my hip replaced right away, it's killing me. Sorry sir, but we see that one time when you were 12 you fell down and hit your hip, therefore we are classifying your current hip problem as a "pre-existing condition" so we won't be paying this claim. OH, and it looks like you forgot to tell us that you used to work summers outside when you applied for insurance...we'll have to investigate this and may have to drop your coverage entirely. We'll get back you on that.
Stupid much Gitarfan? The unions workers are working for HALF pay including their benefits so thats preferential treatment? I don't think your nuts, your just a typical misinformed Fake News viewer.
The Guv Walker promised Wisconsin 250,000 new jobs and never admits that since he has been in office Wisconsin continues to loose jobs. They talk about how they are going to fix the economy but still have not heard how.
governor Walker, your a liar and a bad one at the, you don't even have the character to admit the truth, you and your party are destroying the middle class in this country.
your a selfish loser!!!!
I'm a Loser
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5r0HTV7WkQk
Do you remember the recall?
Don't worry sixpack, on Nov 7 you'll still have the crosseyed BS penis head from Wis, but thats all you'll have.
Fat Ed is still pissed that Walker won the recall, by more than he did the first time. Fat Ed was getting paid by the unions to hype this thing and get people to vote Walker out. Well it back fired. Remember all the Democrats in WI left the state hiding. What a bunch of wimps.
Um, Walker won the recall becuase the voters believed the recall was not the course of action that should have been taken. He will be gone in his next election.
That is the GOP problem, they enter some kind of alternative universe where nothing is as it seems and completely misread election outcomes.
Will be their downfall come November 2012.
I KNOW Rachel was itching to get to Walker because she never can in real life - he won't have anything to do with her.
CONGRATS, Rachel, for calling his bluff on live TV. You totally ROCK!!!!!!!!!!!
Itching huh?
Okay, good. but frankly you need to do even better with weasels like Scott Walker. I still feel like you let him get away with the lies. You can't let up, seriously. You have to keep pounding these people until the falter. They are working from a script for Christ's sake. I didn't see the falter there. He was almost ready to crumble, but you fell short. To an uniformed so-called "independent" viewer, you accomplished nothing.
I wouldn't say they accomplished nothing, but you are right, they gave him the last word and to someone who hasn't been paying attention, they make think he "won" the debate. One thing Ed and the Rev do is argue with people instead of questioning and challenging them and holding them accountable for what they say.
That's because the rep. don't stop to take a breath while they are lying, they don't give anyone a chance to get in a 2nd question. They just keep lying so the one asking the question runs out of time!!!!!!!
For 2 nights in a row, watching the RNC, I heard so many lies, I thought sure they would be called on them all. It was like being at a Liars Anonymous meeting. Nobody on the other channels called them the liars they are. CNN finally got the message after being bombarded with emails from viewers, but seemed embarrassed to even correct the lies. I watch Chris, Al, Ed and Rachel every night for a reason-they always tell the truth. Thanks!
#13. You need to open you right eye and pull that plug out of you right ear and then you will be able to hear the truth.
This is just for Theresa: Read it and weep -
Exibit A, your typical teabagger sucker supporter.
Scott Walker trying to blame Obama for a plant closing before his presidency. Fox News trying to blame Obama for a poor response to Katrina three years before his presidency. Limbaugh trying to blame Obama for the weather in Florida. Is there a psychological name for this strange phenomenon? Persistent-perpetual-chronoflubosis? Blamalamadingdong? The Devil Syndrome? Chronic Histoydistrustus? The Wow! Really!? Dysfunction. Severe he-is-not-us? Inflamed weberacists?
The fat wrong head affliction?
Moronism...
The republicans have lied thier entire life, what makes you think they will stop now? I watch MSNBC Maddow all the time, and yes Rachael, you let Walker off to easy, Ive seen you better on TV and the media has to correct the wrong, the lies, . Rev Al, I would love to sit next to you and debate these lieing idiots, I would prove them all wrong and embarass the hell out of them on National TV. Truth shall set you free, I really don't think the repubs understand the truth and how they look on National TV outright lieing, makes them look insane. The Pres has made mistakes hes human, but the main reason I will vote for him is because he put down hard regulations, to make sure what happened under the Repubs doesn't happen again. They are like spoiled children, you took away what they can no longer have, the right to stick it to taxpayers
They have nothing to run on so they have to keep telling lies thinking people won't know. God help us all if they get in there. it's going to be worst then it was when Bush was in there. I can only hope that the people are smarter then that.
did anyone else hear Jan Brewer say "I know that if president Obama is elected in november, which I hope that he is"?
I absolutely heard her say that! What a bad interview. She can't even speak with any real conviction or extemporaneous thought. All talking points all the time. Pathetic....
Yes I did!
Republicans like Scott Walker love to gloss over the fact that our country is facing large problems with our automobile sector that transcend their GOP notions of what a recovery should even look like. We live in the world economy of the 21st century that transcend American notions of the nation state or the notion of American "exceptionalism." We are not going to be able to keep burning cheap oil in the future. The Non-OECD (Asia) countries have surpassed the oil consumption of the OECD countries (US, Can,Europe) for the first time this year. The GOP never talks about this crucial fact. The GOP also does not like to talk about the fact that we are at peak world oil production. The International Energy Agency stated clearly in its 2010 Energy Outlook that the era of cheap oil is over with. We are drilling more oil wells than ever and it seems to only make the 2% of oil reserves that we do have dry up all the faster through our 250 million tailpipes.
Let us put two critical facts together for our economics challenged conservative friends on the right side of the aisle. The world supply of oil has peaked or leveled off. Peak world oil production does not mean that we will run out of oil tomorrow but it does mean that the era of cheap accessible oil is rapidly winding down. Now let's look at those pesky Non-OECD countries that are mostly in Asia. China and India are huge industrial powerhouses today. China has been building in excess of ten million vehicles annually for the last couple of years. China is expected to produce and drive 100 million more automobiles and trucks within the next seven years certainly before 2020 China will have more than 100 million cars. India is following closely behind building cars, trucks, and consuming more coal for electricity as is China. Chinese and Indian consumption of fossil fuels are expected to quadruple by 2030. We also need to remember that other countries in the BRIC's and Asian-Pacific rim countries are building or driving more cars. We will have one billion cars before 2020 up from around 800 million or so today.
So lets put these two trends together here and try to connect the dots. We are at or past world peak oil production. At the same time we see a rapidly industrializing Asia that has surpassed Europe and America in oil consumption. What this all means in the global economy is that we can expect $150 per barrel of oil for the rest of our lives in the United States. If we have a war or a major political or economic crisis in a major oil producing country we should plan for oil to spike rapidly to $200 per barrel. Sure there will be vicissitudes where oil will go down in the near term when the business cycle bottoms out. But, just as soon as business activity increases we can expect oil to jump right back up to $150 per barrel or higher.
The country that really understands all of this is Angela Merkel's Germany. Germany has made massive and continuous investments in green energy, bullet trains, and commuter rail. German turbo-diesel cars get 50 MPG and make up about one-half of all car sales in Germany. German ICE bullet trains are among the best in the world providing highly efficient travel for many millions of Germans everyday. German commuter rail and bus service are excellent and hooked up in a highly efficient network to airports, city centers, and other transportation hubs for easy transfer. A stranger in Germany who has the necessary funds can at reasonable cost go anywhere he or she wants rapidly without having to drive a car. The German solar industry is the best in the world. The German wind industry is building huge wind farms on land and out in the North Sea. All of this green energy is connected to efficient smart grids that are expanding across an ever greater portion of the industrial Ruhr down to Munich. An average German has a much higher standard of living than the average American because he or she has health care, a stable economy and they consume on average only one half the amount of oil that the average American does.
President Obama needs to go in front of Congress in January and make a speech that outlines his vision for the next four years. President Obama should go tell Congress that we are in a terrible energy bind and we must take serious measures to get out of our energy bind. We need a massive Apollo energy program that breaks our dependence on imported OPEC oil in less than ten years. We need to build French TGV bullet trains on Interstate 95 from Bangor, Maine down the northeastern corridor to Alexandria, Virginia and beyond to demonstrate the efficiency of the French and German bullet train system. We need to build deep offshore wind farms off both our coasts and the Great Lakes. We need to have solar panels on all roofs on the Southwest, California, and the South. We need more wind farms on the Plains states. We to connect our power plants to smart grids that transfers power efficiently from one section of the country to the other. We can start paying for this Apollo program an infrastructure with a public-private corporation that sells bonds for building these projects. We also need to have a massive effort at cogeneration, insulation of homes, businesses, and the energy conservation in all American homes needs to be pushed for all that we are worth.
The country that is 20 years ahead of where the United States needs to be is Angela Merkel's Germany. The United States has urinated away $7.3 trillion on aircraft carrier task force groups from 1976-2007 to protect our oil supplies from unstable parts of the world. All the money Germany spends on green energy gets reinvested in the German economy creating jobs, business activity, and economic growth. Germany can just build more solar and wind farms and does not have to worry about trillions of dollars spent on carrier task force groups either. German energy supplies are secure.
If we do not as a country develop an Apollo energy program to get off of imported OPEC oil we will know no peace in our lifetimes. The United States will face endless cycles of violence, terrorism, warfare, and death caused by the geopolitics of imported OPEC oil from volatile unstable parts of the world. We have spent $4 trillion long term in Iraq and Afghanistan on top of 5,000 killed and at least 50,000 wounded not counting many PTSD and brain trauma wounded that could well number in the 100,000 plus range. New wars are brewing in the Horn of Africa that sit astride our oil supply lines that tie down significant numbers of U.S. military forces and material. If we do not get off of imported OPEC oil we will have to suffer another 50,000 casualties to fight another trillion dollar war for a $200 per barrel of oil. All of our jobs will go to Asia while no jobs are left in America. The only really large industrial country that understands this and acted on this knowledge of dwindling fossil fuel supplies is Germany. I wish the American press would start covering German green energy and German bullet trains. The Germans are right about this energy issue period. We had damn well better start catching up here in America to Germany unless we want to see more names of soldiers stenciled on marble memorial walls to celebrate our dead soldiers along with our dying fossil fuel based economy.
May I re-post your excellent observation(s) on a different forum?
Brian; These ideas are from many people so sure, the more we talk about energy policy the better. Normally I use citations for references if you want any of those I can get you sources. Sometimes I just feel like writing though, because after 20 years of being involved with warfare with the military I just have to write and not worry about citing everything. Please correct grammar if you reprint some of this, I make mistakes as you can see.
Rex,
One of the best - well thought out essays I have read. You really have tied all the pieces together, economy, political life, society and linked them to the energy policy of the United States. Thank-you, I am stealing this and reposting and I hope you will keep writing!
Former Marine Crops Infantry Officer here... this is excellent, sir!
Retired Chief Petty Officer USN Obviously you have put alot of thought into this article.. Very good piece of work. Now to get this to the American public before it's too late.
Excuse me Scott Walker,the jobs in Janesville and Kenosha were under your watch as you were running all over the Country at that time that were lost.Paul Ryan never paid any attention,he was in Washington all time,building his political career Kind of like you Scott Walker with the Divide and Conquer Mentality.You would have never won the Recall Election had we run a different candidate against.We were better off in Wisconsin,when Jim Doyle was Governor.He wasn't running around all over the Country trying to collect money from the Elite.,and busing them in to cover your behind.one might say that Recall Election was bought by your elite friends,and your face on TV 24/7 You have run WI like Romney run Ma.We have lost more jobs in the State since you been in officethan any other time in a long time. You have never kept your promises. am so very tired od your lies,lie,after lie,after lie. You have hurt so many people in my State,unpthamable.Maybe your Divide and Conquer has started to work,I am so very sorry to say. You should get over you cockiness,and running all over the Country and start being Governor of Wisconsin.
Walker is such a sleeze! Too bad Rachel & Ed let him get the last word I knew he was going to have that smerk on his face after they did that! They had him on the ropes and they let him off!! Ed usually wouldn't have done that! The Rev & Lawrence wouldn't have let him! Our right LIARS should never be let off the hook! MSNBC isn't FOX!
Wrong again. Weasel walker ducked Ed the whole week he was in Wis. But what would you expect from a coward?
By the way, you do know that Will Rodgers was a Democrat don't you? And he was correct, there IS a sucker born every minute. Just look at the teabaggers.
Walker made them all look stupid. Obama the candidate did in deed say "with government support this plant will be open for 100 years." Well the government did in deed support GM, or at least the UAW, and the plant is stilled closed, as are hundreds of dealerships, and other plants. Bye the way I love the number of positive tweets on MSNBC, looks like some Democrats have been converted, or at least like they are actually rethinking their position.
BINGO! You are a winner!
changing no we like the lies thats why we are on here, Obama /Biden
2e.... The tweets show the same thing as the recall did. One thing is fed to the public and the public feeds the truth back. It's hard for these liberals to hear anything inside that bubble. It's obviously sound proof.
2ez - The thing about the plant closure is that it was a business decision , a sound business, decision that had to be made for the rest of the company to survive. Also, the dealerships that were lost were for the same reasons. If a cancer is eating at your body, if you can, you remove the cancer, and that increases the patient's survival chances.
Robert, You are right, but in this case the cancer was and continues to be the UAW. How many years until the cancer eats even more of the body. How long until the Doctor or in this case Tax Payer will be called on?
That's right - blame labor. I belonged to a union for 37 years.Yes, they do have their problems, but they empower the working class to stand up for what should be theirs. The big boys at the top of big business today make a disproportionate income compared to the workers. Remember the 1990's? Ford got big concessions from the UAW and immediately turned around and gave all the top executives huge bonuses that were paid for by those very concessions! this is what I can remember and why we do need unions. 2ez- look it up. It was in the news.
Robert, If an executive produced significant savings via Collective Barganning, I would give him a bonus too. I personally don't believe unskilled UAW laborers performing a simple repetitive tasks earn their compensation. The average UAW member has a compensation package, (pay, medical, and pension) that is three times the median income. At best they should be making 12 to 15 dollars an hour, and they should be contributing to the medical and pension plans.
The cancer in GM will come back and you will probably blame the Tax Payer.
Walker made him self look like a lying fool. They nailed Walker on that time frame. How can you blame Obama for something that happened in Bush presidency? It was closed before Obama took office. Also the whole republican party has voted no to everything Obama has tried to pass to help this country. It was a Republican vandeta. Knowing this. So how many messes did you think Obama should have fixed with Republicans lying and covering up their tracks since Obama has been in Office?
WRONG! Thanks for playing. Try again next time.
He's done more than enough at this moment, come janurary he will do more, providing he has a house full of dems, in the house, and more in the Senate. So thomas in Cali, your wrong we are right
#22 At least one.
You ppl actually DO live in a constant state of denial. Unbelieveable.
MSNBC sucks so much. They only cover the Republican convention so they can spew their liberal Demo garbage. Gov. Scott Walker owned everyone on that panel and made them look like silly fools. Then after the panel got owned, they couldn't let it go so they revert to what they do best by trying to talk over someone telling the facts.
"With government support this plant will be open for 100 years." -Obama (The Deceiver)
"Doesn't matter how much you try to talk over me, the facts are the facts." -Scott Walker (MSNBC Panel Destroyer)
And yet, here you are, Thomas. If MSNBC sucks so much, why not meander over to FAUX's site? Walker owns nothing...he is, like so many of his ilk, jealous and envious of a president who blew them all away like so much dust in 2008, and will do it again in 2012. How's that envy and jealousy workin' for ya, Thomas?
Hey,Kitty - Seems our President and his ilk were blown away in the RECORD 2010 election rebuke of the faux leader Obama and his extremist progressive pals in congress when the country woke up to the fact that he was an inept leader who was and is just a lot of teleprompter talk with no substance. AND Walker survived the roudy crowd of union anarchists' attempt to recall him.
Thomas in Cali, you have this backwards--it's the republicans that talk the same lies continuously over everyone else so that time runs out and they don't have to answer any more questions.
As if Ed had all the time in the world. Good grief he gets his point across and then Walker snides him with his "theory" (Ed) that doesn't hold water. Even Rachelle couldn't rebut an unproven theory with her saying that no private investor was going to invest; but that's the non logic (bs) that suffices for some who have no record or facts to back it up.
Talk about a lying phony; these guys are all over Obama saying something that he actually did; save the auto industry, albeit he didn't retroactively save the WI plant. Gee now we have poor little disappinted Ryan; whose record totally belies what he is saying now whether it's about his stand on medicare or the deficit. Again I'll remind you that Obama saved the auto industry as he stood for it then and now. Good luck with the "deficit hawk" who promoted himself by voting for all the Bush expenditures to put this country in the hole that he blames Obama for, and good luck with gramma who according to him, is his new best friend.
You mean the expenditures that were passed by the DEMOCRAT controlled HOR and Senate?
just saying...
A record number of filibusters in the senate the past four yrs. So who controlls the senate again?
Last time I checked, it was the Democrats...too bad they cant learn how to compromise so that some things could get through.
just saying...
The party of "NO" 'eh stormtrooper?
Just sayin....lol
Walker, Ryan both Kock Brothers funded lying Republican sacks of crap that will say or do anything to win. The real problem is the American electorate; the idiot brigade of moron voters that keep voting them in!
the moron voters are the one that put that illegal immigrant in the white house..
67 more days then his ass is out, got to love the change...
He's not illegal #31.1........... Look up Frank Marshall Davis on YouTube or anywhere else you want.
John:
that is funny coming from someone who supports a a party where one of its top members (Harry Reid) has been proven by the NY Time to have been lying when he made the comment about Romney not paying taxes...yet, no apology from him for the character assassination.
Politics is a dirty game...ask Spike Lee. If you don't want to play...get out.
just saying..
No capt re reg you are just lying again, that is what I'm just saying means in reality. Funny how that always escapes your notice, when Glenda Beck says he is just saying what he really means is he just made it up. See capt re reg, Reid is not lying because who knows if robme hood paid all of his taxes or how much wealth robme hood stole from pensions, only his account knows the truth. Funny capt re reg you demand proof of Obama's citizenship yet you are willing to take the word of a habitual liar that he isn't a felon.
no, whom, actually, the NY Times DID debunk Harry Reid's false claim...ROmney got a foreign tax credit...the ONLY way to get it??? pay taxes to the IRS...therefore, you may cry about him paying FOREIGN taxes, and not American taxes, but he DID file with the IRS, and DID pay them...
oops...caught again...you may have to turn your attention to the NY Times- they seem to be "lying" to your side a LOT lately...
COTT...
Thanks for the assist. One day...and I keep hoping I am right on this...Whom will actually say something that shows he/she has some degree of intelligence. Trust me...I am not holding my breath waiting for that to happen.
it seems that he/she is the liar that he/she accuses every other person to be...
I have challenged him/her numerous times to show any post where I have questioned Obama's citizenship and if he/she did, then I would leave this blog forever...please note that I am still here and am not going anywhere...
I even challenged him/her to actually show that I have lied about anything and I would leave....notice that I am still here...
too bad he/she isnt confident enough in his/her truthfulness to make the same wager.
just saying...
http://www.cjr.org/swing_states_project/another_fact-checking_fiasco.php?page=all
The only way you can disprove Reid is if robme hood releases his tax records which robmme hood refuses to do. You can't call someone a liar when there is no proof that he lied and that proof is found in robme hoods tax records. So once again we get lying tea bagged republicans lying to hide they can't prove Reid lied.
Whom will actually say something that shows he/she has some degree of intelligence. Trust me...I am not holding my breath waiting for that to happen.
you are wise to not hold your breath...
i've offered the same challenge...he comments all the time about how my racism shows up in "every post", and yet he hasn't been able to show me 1 example of racism I've used, ever...
he is what i like to call a "bombthrower"...he runs in, throws a bomb, does his damage, and runs away like a coward...
The problem is not that I don't say anything intelligent the problem is that when you have an IQ of a box of rocks you have no clue as to what intelligence is. That is what happens when you never ask questions rather instead you hear people telling you what you want to hear and you believe any lie said more then 3 times magically turns the lie into unquestionable truth.
In the words of Ron Burgundy:
Beg to differ. Agree to disagree.
The last time I checked, our judicial system is based on a system of innocent until proven guilty...so, I think Reid has the burden of proof on him to show that Romney has not paid taxes.
just saying...
'We're Not Going to Let Our Campaign Be Dictated by Fact-Checkers'
AUG 28 2012, 3:40 PM
This new approach was signaled on Sunday, when, as James Fallows has noted,The New York Times, in a front-page story, flatly stated that a Romney ad was "falsely charging that Mr. Obama has 'quietly announced' plans to eliminate work and job training requirements for welfare beneficiaries."
But what if it turns out that when the press calls a lie a lie, nobody cares?
Here in Tampa, the new assertiveness is getting its first test on a big stage, and so far the results are not encouraging. As Ben Smith of BuzzFeed has pointed out, the Romney campaign is simply swatting aside the media's objections to its welfare ad: "We're not going to let our campaign be dictated by fact-checkers," said Neil Newhouse, a Romney pollster.
http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2012/08/were-not-going-to-let-our-campaign-be-dictated-by-fact-checkers/261674/
TRC...the NYT also stated that Harry Reid's claims agains Romney related to not paying taxes was completely false. When is the Obama campaign going to disavow the lie that Reid made ?
just saying...